As far as I understand, people using this site to contact their elected officials were instrumental in making lawmakers back down from ChatControl v2.0. Hoping the same will be true this time around.
The proposals apply to “providers” of “hosting services“, of “interpersonal communications service”, and of “software application stores” (you can look up the definitions for yourself in the published texts). It’s hard to see how that would apply to purely P2P systems, except that distributing an app for it via app stores would likely require user age verification.
Flathub, the snap store, gnome software, etc. all technically meet the definitino of software application store.
Makes me wonder (and worry) if they can stretch the definition to apply to standard package repos as well. Are we going to be entering an era where you have to verify your identity & age to apt-get software?
I think that real danger is a very real possibility with legislation like this. Not in the way that you won't be able to buy "unlocked" devices, but that web services and government services just flat out won't be accessible to you if you aren't on a sanctioned device (with the sanctioned spyware).
Think things like requiring play integrity attestation to access banking, or an equivalent service baked into macOS, Windows, iOS. If you aren't on one of those proprietary and spied on OSes, you can't access most of the web.
So technically the hardware will remain relatively open, but they'll make it so you can't interact with the rest of society with it.
That would still be the relatively benign outcome. You can have one device for all the official stuff, and another device for your own software, “free“ OSs and the “free” internet. However, I could see a future where anything that accesses the internet is required to be an iPhone-like clamped down device.
the worst (and the only) way possible: hold authors or distributors of the said software responsible: Order apple and google to remove apps, Order ISPs to block domains that host PWAs, Issue arrest warrants for authors of software that does not or cannot comply.
Legit question: if this disaster of a legislation passes, what are the alternatives to provide secure messaging / comms when you are inside the EU?
The only 2 options that I can think about are:
- The Dark Web: TOR, I2P (<--- not sure why I2P didn't gain more popularity) or potemntially other alternatives in the same space
- VPN outside the EU and access a secure messaging system via the VPN exit point. This would assume that the system would have E2EE / some kind of at least superficial privacy guarantees.
Am I missing any major category / tech combination?
The EU has been taken over by terrorists and law enforcement does nothing. People behind Chat Controls should be arrested.
These proposals are against German laws and other EU countries. It can be treated as terrorist attack attempt.
It creates psychological and physical harm, indiscriminately for ideological gain. Textbook terrorism, except done by nice people in suits and there is no blood (yet).
The mass import of potential terrorists are the pretext to introduce this panopticon. Quite the play. You push your agenda, by pushing stochastic events that forward it.
https://fightchatcontrol.eu/
As far as I understand, people using this site to contact their elected officials were instrumental in making lawmakers back down from ChatControl v2.0. Hoping the same will be true this time around.
On the contrary, it doesn't seem to have had any effect at all. Nobody actually defeated anything if it just gets re-proposed a few weeks later.
Ah, the US way, just keep trying to pass the bill again and again until people get tired and it eventually passes quietly.
Winning a battle and living to fight another day is useful. Does not mean the fight is over, of course.
Every time we stop it from becoming law, that is a victory.
Viewing it as anything else is actively counterproductive.
The fact that they will keep bringing it back until we have better people in the EU Parliament just means that we have to win more victories.
They haven't yet dared to bring it to the parliament because then they'd have to let it be defeated.
How would these types of proposals deal with foss non centralized/fully p2p messaging system? Just make them illegal?
What if the foss app has the “scanning” but can be disabled with a compile time flag
Is my email client going to have to implement this scanning if I use pgp?
The proposals apply to “providers” of “hosting services“, of “interpersonal communications service”, and of “software application stores” (you can look up the definitions for yourself in the published texts). It’s hard to see how that would apply to purely P2P systems, except that distributing an app for it via app stores would likely require user age verification.
Flathub, the snap store, gnome software, etc. all technically meet the definitino of software application store.
Makes me wonder (and worry) if they can stretch the definition to apply to standard package repos as well. Are we going to be entering an era where you have to verify your identity & age to apt-get software?
Or switch to P2P distribution.
The real danger is if hardware becomes dongled by firmware that doesn’t allow you to install anything you want anymore.
I think that real danger is a very real possibility with legislation like this. Not in the way that you won't be able to buy "unlocked" devices, but that web services and government services just flat out won't be accessible to you if you aren't on a sanctioned device (with the sanctioned spyware).
Think things like requiring play integrity attestation to access banking, or an equivalent service baked into macOS, Windows, iOS. If you aren't on one of those proprietary and spied on OSes, you can't access most of the web.
So technically the hardware will remain relatively open, but they'll make it so you can't interact with the rest of society with it.
That would still be the relatively benign outcome. You can have one device for all the official stuff, and another device for your own software, “free“ OSs and the “free” internet. However, I could see a future where anything that accesses the internet is required to be an iPhone-like clamped down device.
the worst (and the only) way possible: hold authors or distributors of the said software responsible: Order apple and google to remove apps, Order ISPs to block domains that host PWAs, Issue arrest warrants for authors of software that does not or cannot comply.
Legit question: if this disaster of a legislation passes, what are the alternatives to provide secure messaging / comms when you are inside the EU? The only 2 options that I can think about are:
- The Dark Web: TOR, I2P (<--- not sure why I2P didn't gain more popularity) or potemntially other alternatives in the same space
- VPN outside the EU and access a secure messaging system via the VPN exit point. This would assume that the system would have E2EE / some kind of at least superficial privacy guarantees.
Am I missing any major category / tech combination?
Recent and related:
The disguised return of EU Chat Control - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45929511 - Nov 2025 (340 comments)
The EU has been taken over by terrorists and law enforcement does nothing. People behind Chat Controls should be arrested.
These proposals are against German laws and other EU countries. It can be treated as terrorist attack attempt.
It creates psychological and physical harm, indiscriminately for ideological gain. Textbook terrorism, except done by nice people in suits and there is no blood (yet).
The germans would love it most. Gotta find those people guilty of Wrong Think like nuclear power being safe.
The mass import of potential terrorists are the pretext to introduce this panopticon. Quite the play. You push your agenda, by pushing stochastic events that forward it.
It’s almost as if the EU keeps getting it wrong, time and time again with technology.
I'm starting to think that maybe they are not great at doing their job.